Addressing the Issue of the Keyboard Extension

@FishNotADish2 said in #39:
> When did lichess say they don’t want to get rid of the keyboard exstension?

Based on the below statements, I concluded that lichess just doesn’t want to get rid of the kb cheat engine.

@A_0123456 said in #1:
> Yes, I get it, there have been a million forums about this, but there's no way we can continue kicking the can down the road.

@Doofenshmirtz said in #4:
> @A_0123456
> But Thibault has explicitly said in previous discussions that he's perfectly happy with kb.

@FishNotADish2 said in #39:
> It feels more like they can’t, and yes these features should be implemented. I mean it’s fair to at least be able to choose if your opponent has an advantage. But the question is how to implement this

lichess is an open source platform, if users can figure out how to hack lichess in order to cheat, users can help lichess be able to fight against it. I’m sure there’s a way to do these things but I do not have that knowledge because I’m not a programer, though others would find a way.

@mburg33
I actually asked where Thibault said that he's perfectly happy (as a response in this forum) with kb, but have been able to find nothing about that (even when I looked it up on Thibault's forum posts). #4 itself seems to be a kinda controversial post with 4 likes and 6 dislikes, so it's unclear what Thibault actually said.
Also over time, public opinion of kb has changed considerably, so maybe that's why there's been a lot of forums. Just to check on public opinion. Last time a kb forum occurred, about 80% of the people agreed that kb is cheating. It seems to have increased to over 90% this time.

At this point, the only thing we can really do is get more people here so that they relay their opinions and wait for lichess to give an official response to this. Without an official response, we don't have much data to conclude with.

@A_0123456 said in #40:
> @mburg33 I don't think it's like Lichess doesn't want kb to go. Lichess is unwilling to give an opinion on kb and they have been like that for a while. This was especially because a considerable portion of the playerbase used to think that kb was legal, even a good amount of non-kb users, so trying to stop kb would have been disastrous potentially. However, as we have looked more closely into the issue and as more players have quit ultrabullet due to the unfairness of kb, public opinion seems to have shifted - and rightfully so.
>
> At least that's what I've heard so far since my time on the forums (since December 2019)

If lichess is just unwilling to hold up to their ideals despite not having to listen to CEOs, Executives & Shareholders, then what’s the point in having an Open Source platform where everyone can have input on it. I don’t like it that lichess is holding off on this even though it’s obviously against their TOS/Fair Play Rules, it just smells of playing politics and trying to keep your base even if they’re wrong. Lichess should educate players on what is and what is not cheating and make it abundantly clear. I really want lichess to succeed but after learning about this, I’m getting really concerned that lichess is going to have a reputation of “where people go to cheat in cash award tournaments” & then users will drop. I’m very new to lichess and only learned about it several months ago after just getting into chess again. I like playing on lichess because chess.com doesn’t allow me to play and watch YouTube/Twitch at the same time while lichess does (in addition to so many other upsides). Lichess has lots to improve on still in order to remain competitive with the people who own the name of the game as the domain name. If lichess isn’t careful, they will lose their edge.

I've been wondering why I always seem to loose on time in bullet games. And how I can never compete in Ultrabullet.

Until today I thought it was my moving skills or connection. I normally play on my phone. On my computer with a mouse, I'm much worse.

Had no idea about keyboard players.

So can we have the option in our settings to not play keyboard players? or a tournament where we can explicitly not compete against keyboard players?

I just want to get better at playing chess and have the rating reflect if I'm making an improvement or not.

@Tyrant-I said in #45:
> So can we have the option in our settings to not play keyboard players? or a tournament where we can explicitly not compete against keyboard players?
>
> I just want to get better at playing chess and have the rating reflect if I'm making an improvement or not.

Does lichess have the capability to detect plugins?

@A_0123456 :

@A_0123456 said in #46:
> @Tyrant-I said in #45:
>
> So can we have the option in our settings to not play keyboard players? or a tournament where we can explicitly not compete against keyboard players?
>
> I just want to get better at playing chess and have the rating reflect if I'm making an improvement or not.
>
>
> Does lichess have the capability to detect plugins?

Detecting: Yes
Avoid: No

Have a look at youtube and adblocker ....

Edit:
So @Tyrant-I question could be answered with "yes". As well the question, "can" lichess avoid "kb" or other addons.
"You only have to setup a team" which does nothing else, than lookin for addons and addons and addons and discuss this question for every issue in the forum.
Just like a hamster in his wheel.

Edit Edit:
Lichess could do a "part of truth" to the conditions of use to become peace with this issues.
You may write:
There is a reziprog correlation between the game length and the power of addons.
Short games may have results that base on two reasons. The quality of playing and the using of addons. So be aware by playing this part of lichess. Lichess will not regulate this. The players have to do their gameplay themself.
(after this, you could make KB to a klickable part of lichess, so everyone knows and can use or not)

Something like this and I hope my bad english dosen't destroy the sense.

Adresssing the argument of kB not breaking the
“1. Cheating. We define this as using any external assistance to strengthen your knowledge and, or, calculation ability to gain an unfair advantage over your opponent. “

According to these rules, I could make a bot that knows every line of possible moves, and it isn’t strengthing “my” knoledge, and it’s not a calculation ability strengthener, because it knows every line already, and the move seems to play with it before, so it isn’t caculating.

I still don’t get why it wouldn’t be fair for both people not to have outside matierial.

No one talks about the second rule also,
2. Artificially inflating or deflating your rating. This is where a User purposefully loses, or has arranged with an opponent to win. As a result, the User’s rating will artificially increase or decrease.

Hmm a plug-in that’s “artificial” (meaning from the outside, not originally inputted) that helps you move faster whenever you need or want to. And does other stuff.

@FishNotADish2 said in #48:
> Adresssing the argument of kB not breaking the
> “1. Cheating. We define this as using any external assistance to strengthen your knowledge and, or, calculation ability to gain an unfair advantage over your opponent. “
>
> According to these rules, I could make a bot that knows every line of possible moves, and it isn’t strengthing “my” knoledge, and it’s not a calculation ability strengthener, because it knows every line already, and the move seems to play with it before, so it isn’t caculating.
>
> I still don’t get why it wouldn’t be fair for both people not to have outside matierial.

And that's what we all have pointed out. The text below that says that it's not only limited to certain stuff, but rather, can be applied in a broader context.

Also your hypothetical bot does strengthen your knowledge because you'll learn what the better moves are and play them.